TEX SAYS...
Now, back to our regularly scheduled programming....Here's an interesting letter from the Amway India business. Looking forward to similar rules coming to the U.S.
http://www.thetruthaboutamway.com/index.php/component/option,com_fireboard/Itemid,91/func,view/id,10747/catid,30/
Here's the letter as well, in the event it "disappears" from Insider's site:
AMWAY INDIA B.S.M. DISCUSSION PAPER & RECOMMENDATIONS
NOVEMBER, 2007
Foreword:
The following B.S.M. discussion paper and subsequent recommendations ‘that flow from it’ are the final result of a comprehensive review that began in May 2007. That review included detailed discussion with B.S.M / System Owners, International Diamonds, all in-Country Diamonds, presentations to most Platinums in India and finally input from a global B.S.M. Meeting convened in Grand Rapids in early October, 2007.
It reflects the unique and at times difficult regulatory environment in India, the concerns that have been raised as a result of the AP matter and of course the ‘learnings’ from other markets around the world, not the least of which is the U.K.
Where appropriate, commentary / explanation preceeds the different recommendations and readers of this document should view the recommendations as proposed “additions” to the current rule……not as a replacement for it.
The recommendations presented have not been framed as rules within this paper and will be integrated into the current B.S.M. rule, with appropriate language and detail once all feedback has been received and final decisions taken. That will be no later than December, 15th, 2007.
General Philosophy:
B.S.M’s and meetings , their content, pricing, frequency and Brand presentation should compliment and enhance the Amway Business and never intentionally or unintentionally interfere with or disrupt it. Good education should be made available to the maximum number of ABO’s at the best possible price. Risk should be eliminated from this aspect of the business.
1. Branding:
RECOMMENDATIONS:
• All Major meetings and BBS’s must display prominent Amway branding. Sub branding is allowed. For example:
AMWAY MEETING
Proudly Sponsored by Sanjay Diamond
• Amway branding on all B.S.M.’s will be required, with the exception of books that are generally found in the public domain. “Amway Approved B.S.M.” will be required to be printed on all tapes, CDs, DVDs or printed material, with the exception , of books, as previously mentioned.
2. Content & Quantity:
There is a need to standardize the content of all Amway related Meetings & BSMs to ensure correct and more consistent messaging is achieved. Income examples untilised in Plans and Opens must be ‘real’ and products / customers must be promoted with equal emphasis as to recruiting more ABO’s. There must be ‘balance’ in all teaching, whether from the stage, on a B.S.M.’s, or in a face to face counseling situation.
Amway believes it is appropriate to limit the number of B.S.M. SKU’s that can be sold by any one individual, group or System. Currently the number of B.S.M.’s available is disproportionate to the Core business offering. Amway would prefer not to make this a rule and will look towards productive discussions and agreements with System Owners to address this issue with a view to significantly reducing the number of B.S.M.’s on offer, so that it is at parity with the overall Amway business.
RECOMMENDATIONS:
The Plan:
• Concepts and Income Examples will be per Company direction and format. They must be used.
• Customers must be shown
• 15 minutes live product demo or playing of a 15 minute product demo CD is mandatory
• Money back guarantees must be clearly explained on both products and the business opportunity
• Prospects must be told that income is generated from the sale of products
• Prospects must be told that B.S.M.’s are optional and not mandatory.
• A ‘leave behind brochure’ (currently being developed by the Company) will be mandatory and must be given to all who see the plan.
Meetings (Major & B.B.S.):
• A balanced content in all meetings of approximately 30% motivation, 30% product information and 30% teaching & recognition will be mandatory.
• Speaker guildelines developed by Amway must be given to every speaker well in advance of their presentation and must be adhered to.
B.S.M.’s (Tapes, CDs, DVDs, Printed Material):
• All B.S.M.’s will have to be approved by Amway prior to distribution and must carry an “Amway approved B.S.M.” sticker on them.
• All product related B.S.M.’s will only be produced and distributed by Amway.
• All A.S.M.P. related B.S.M.’s will only be produced and distributed by Amway.
3. Costs:
For the new ABO will remain the same per the current B.S.M. rule. Please note that Amway will be reducing the cost of the Starter Kit substantially in early 2008 and hence the value of B.S.M.’s that can be sold to a ‘new’ Business Owner will reduce proportionally and as per the current rule. Amway will advise the new kit pricing criteria and the subsequent amount of BSM’s / meeting tickets a ‘new’ ABO can purchase in the first 30 days, in due course.
RECOMMENDATION:
• Prices as currently stated in the B.S.M. Policy will be maintained and not increased.
4. Transparency:
New ABOs joining the Amway Business who are promoted B.S.M.’s and Meetings not produced by Amway, need to understand that these recommendations are linked to a separate business………. that generates profit to its promoters.
RECOMMENDATION:
• Written disclosure to prospects who become ‘new’ ABOs will be mandatory, relative to informing them that the promotion and sale of non Amway B.S.M.’s and / or Meeting tickets, is a business and that profits are made from same.
Concluding Comments:
The aforementioned recommendations for inclusion into the B.S.M. Rule, we believe substantially reduces the risk to the Amway business in India, whilst allowing education / motivation by independent Third Party Vendors, to continue.
Whilst Amway appreciates that costs are going up in India and that some Leaders encouraged us to increase B.S.M. and Meeting prices to counter that…..in the current regulatory environment, and considering the recent strong growth currently being experienced in India, AIE does want to do anything to change the status quo relevant to pricing and hence does not feel B.S.M. or meeting price increases would be prudent at this time. We will continue to review this on an annual basis.
The Company has taken the decision to become much more pro-active in providing B.S.M.’s and Meetings in the future and will shortly publish a schedule of events across the country. All LOS’s will be invited to attend, as will speakers from the various organizations. This initiative will not be a profit center for Amway and therefore prices will reflect that.
Whilst Amway will encourage all to attend and participate in our events , we of course respect that ABO’s have a ‘choice’ and it is up to them to decide whatever they do or do not want to participate in…..or what B.S.M.’s they do or don’t want to buy. However, it should be noted that Rule 5.5 expressly states that a “Sponsor must use his best efforts to encourage his personally sponsored distributors to attend Amway meetings and other functions” …and in this regard, if any ABO is found to dispromote, intimidate or try to prevent his downline from participating in Amway events or from buying Amway B.S.M.’s…………… Amway India, observing a zero tolerance policy would terminate that ABO immediately.
As with all rules, it is the ‘spirit’ and not the ‘letter’ of the actual rule that makes it effective. Amway India looks forward to the future and to working with all stakeholders who have a vested interest in providing excellent education / motivation, to the most number of ABO’s , at the best possible price and without risk.
Regards,
AMWAY INDIA ENTERPRISES
Thursday, January 31, 2008
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22 comments:
By the way, pcj, I wrote this entire letter and demanded Amway sign off on it. There, I've taken credit for it, so you won't need that stupid comment on this thread.
I wouldn't doubt that you wrote it: it's stupid.
They're only recommendations. What 'rule changes' were there?
Perhaps, in your VAST international experience and knowledge of Amway business, you could explain why it looks like Amway itself is running meetings and selling BSMs in India?
Also - notice that those 'recommendations' have done nothing to curb any outside BSM sales (see 4.)?
It certainly appears that Amway is running meetings and BSMs on BEHALF of 'kingpins' in India - thus the request to raise prices (and denied).
These 'recommendations' were to be enacted as of 15 Dec 07 - were they?
Those 'recommendations' do nothing, as stated, to do anything about the 'India' tools scam.
How will these 'recommendations' do anything to help the US?
Again - did you even READ the friggin' thing before you decided to take credit for it?
Otherwise, you are NOW officially a 'blogger' - something I am not. Although, I never claimed to be, unlike some other people.
You brought up rule changes, not me.
Isn't it obvious why Amway is running meetings and selling BSM's in India? Haven't you read the history of India's BSM problems over the past couple of years? How ignorant.
What do you mean by "outside" BSM sales? You can sell in the sunshine, not in your apartment?
You doubt they were enacted?
Just like accreditation was optional in the U.S., and is now required in order to qualify for QBI bonuses?
You now know something about changes in India, and the various changes in the UK from other stories (assuming you've kept yourself informed), and this information is available to the U.S. IBO's as well. Seems like a reasonable question to ask: What is A/Q doing about the tool scam in our country?
Why should I read it again, I wrote it, remember?
I'm not a blogger, Dave took my post from another thread and put it here. It doesn't matter anyway, because I don't give a rip about the fine points about forums, discussions, blogs, etc. It's just one big discussion to me.
After being one of the birthday song winners of free supplements on one of the adatudes sites (http://trueibostories.opportunityzone.com/default.aspx), I submitted the following comment (it probably won't get posted, as previous comments regarding Achievers winners on this blog were also not posted), so here's the commenta:
Nick,
I had no clue who sang that song, but I googled the verses and found the answer right away.
There's a lesson there. It has to do with my "favorite" subject, the tool scam. Many claim I overemphasize this issue, but when it makes up the vast majority of profits and has been kept secret for decades, it is hard to overemphasize.
I think future IBO Stories should include the real truth, not the half-truths we have been seeing. A half-truth IS a full lie in my book. The real truth is most of the income for our "dear" upline, who demand adoration, is from the secret tool scam profits, which come directly from our back pockets to theirs.
It is quite easy to find this information with a google search similar to the one I did for the birthday song. I hope this illustrates why the tool scam needs to be shut down ASAP, if not sooner!
You brought up rule changes, not me.
Lie - or stupid, you choose. See your original post:
Looking forward to similar rules coming to the U.S.
Obvious implied that there are 'rules' changes. I know English isn't your first language, but please.
Isn't it obvious why Amway is running meetings and selling BSM's in India? Haven't you read the history of India's BSM problems over the past couple of years? How ignorant.
You tell me. Bet you can't. We'll see if you're right or not - or just bluffing. I call.
What do you mean by "outside" BSM sales? You can sell in the sunshine, not in your apartment?
Well, I told you to LOOK AND ACTUALLY READ #4:
4. Transparency:
New ABOs joining the Amway Business who are promoted B.S.M.’s and Meetings not produced by Amway, need to understand that these recommendations are linked to a separate business………. that generates profit to its promoters.
Note: THOSE BSMs AND MEETING NOT PRODUCED BY AMWAY...
Thanks for showing you didn't even read the thing, as noted.
You doubt they were enacted?
Yes, I do. All you did was copy and paste a letter from IBOFB without understanding anything about it. If you're so 'read-on' to the India business, as claimed above, you should know. You don't. I call, again.
It's a stupid 'recommendation' letter meant to show intent that Amway is 'fixing' the problem - when it does no such thing.
Just like accreditation was optional in the U.S., and is now required in order to qualify for QBI bonuses?
Irrelevant to the India letter. BTW, since QBI bonuses only go to 'accredited' systems - who suddenly makes more money from the 'tools scam'? Amway! Now, that was genius!
You now know something about changes in India, and the various changes in the UK from other stories (assuming you've kept yourself informed), and this information is available to the U.S. IBO's as well. Seems like a reasonable question to ask: What is A/Q doing about the tool scam in our country?
Those were only recommendations for changes as far as India is concerned. UK - well, you're the expert, you tell us what the final verdict is (not in yet, but you pretend it is). As far as the US scam: nothing. Lots of PR, but nothing.
Your reference was to rule changes (and correctly stated are only "recommendations" currently) already made in India. I said I was looking forward (future, not past or present) to RULE CHANGES coming to the U.S. that are SIMILAR to the RECOMMENDATIONS made in the India letter. It does not practical good to have similar recommendations come to the U.S., just as the optional accreditation program has little benefit. In fact, I made the comment within days of the accreditation coming out this program actually provides a false sense of security, as it does little to solve the tool scam problem. Not my problem you go looking for weird ways of interpreting simple concepts.
I call you an idiot. I know what's going on, checkmate.
There have been statements for years referencing tool profits. The issue isn't profit versus none, the issue is HOW MUCH profit is generated. It is the AMOUNT of profit, particularly compared to the Quixtar income, that is the issue (as Rich DeVos correctly stated in 1983). I guess I just took credit for this in your world, right?
How can recommendations be "enacted"? Checkmate. Again. Do you even know where the pieces go on the board?
The relevance to accreditation is both started as optional/not required, and one of them has moved to mandatory (assuming the QBI bonuses are valued). The India could be required down the road. Checkmate. Again. Perhaps you should try tic-tac-toe, it's closer to your IQ.
How does accreditation make Amway more tool scam money?
A/Q isn't doing enough about the tool scam in the U.S., but the times, they are a changing. Remember, the UK and India regulatory actions started before any known regulatory actions in the U.S.
India - recommendations today, potential requirements tomorrow. UK - My theory is they will be allowed to stay operating, as a shutdown decision would be relatively fast and easy to implement. They are probably negotiating terms to keep operating, as the original decision was estimated to be prior to Christmas. U.S. - See above.
It's unfortunate you use your mind for destructive rather than constructive uses. Oh well.
Your reference was to rule changes (and correctly stated are only "recommendations" currently) already made in India.
Currently recommendations that have already been made rule changes.
Right.
You can't even complete a coherent thought without contradicting yourself.
I call you an idiot. I know what's going on, checkmate.
As you say - you brought a chess board to a gun fight.
How can recommendations be "enacted"?
They're called rule changes, idiot.
How does accreditation make Amway more tool scam money?
Ah - the idiot can't even get a simple concept, yet he likes to sling that term around.
OK, I'll explain it again: if Amway doesn't pay QBI bonuses - who keeps the money? Amway. THAT's how Amway now makes more money from the tools scam.
My theory...
I thought you only dealt with 'truth' and 'facts' and denied that you make things up.
It's unfortunate you use your mind for destructive rather than constructive uses. Oh well.
Yes, calling people idiots on the corporate blogs, even after 'Top ten reason's Tex is an idiot' is a #1 search result, is truly constructive.
Still, you masturbate away. Keep up the good work!
You can't even read a sentence without twisting it around in your mind.
There are no guns involved in this discussion, checkmate.
Talk about incoherent statements, "enacting recommendations".
Are you certain there aren't similar bonuses in other countries?
When I don't have enough of the facts, I propose a theory.
Calling others idiots after they call me one is my standard MO, you know that better than anyone.
Still fixated on masturbation?
Tex is an idiot
techs,
Such a deep comment...NOT!
And you still failed to show whether those recommendations were actually enacted in India.
You've claimed it - you just can't prove it...yet insist on arguing
It does not practical good to have similar recommendations come to the U.S., just as the optional accreditation program has little benefit.
Then why proclaim that you are "Looking forward to similar rules coming to the U.S."?
You now know something about changes in India,
I know. I pointed it out. The only 'change' is a stupid recommendation letter by Amway. That's not a change.
Again - what changed?
I said I was looking forward (future, not past or present) to RULE CHANGES coming to the U.S. that are SIMILAR to the RECOMMENDATIONS made in the India letter.
No, you didn't. You are now trying to make that up. But, what you actually said is right there on top.
You can't even read a sentence without twisting it around in your mind.
When I'm given gems like this - there is no need to twist anything:
The India could be required down the road. Checkmate.
We'll let that stand as a typical Tex 'best effort' - contradict yourself repeatedly, make things up, try to change what you said earlier, through in a 'maybe' suddenly - and declare yourself correct.
It is the AMOUNT of profit, particularly compared to the Quixtar income, that is the issue (as Rich DeVos correctly stated in 1983). I guess I just took credit for this in your world, right?
You can try. But we figured it out long before you even showed up.
"Hey, guess what? There's a tools scam!"
- Yeah, we know.
I never claimed to know whether those recommendations for India became rules, all I said is I hope similar ideas would become rules in the U.S.
Recommendations and the current accreditation program are both weak methods of causing change. Rule changes would be a much more serious method of causing change.
The recommendation letter could be the beginning of change, just as the optional accreditation program in the U.S. is now required to get QBI bonuses, which makes accreditation a much more significant program, although in its current form is still not addressing the tool scam.
I type these posts out quickly and don't always use as precise of language as I could. You choose to read them in the most critical view, and accuse me of a meaning that you probably know is untrue, given the number of times I've had to correct you. But keep it up, I don't mind clarifying my position, it makes for more posts from me.
You know about the tool scam, but many IBO's and prospects don't.
I type these posts out quickly and don't always use as precise of language as I could.
I'll stick with my original theory, amply supported by what’s posted above, that you’re just not very bright.
You choose to read them in the most critical view, and accuse me of a meaning that you probably know is untrue, given the number of times I've had to correct you.
Or, you just don’t make sense, and aren’t smart enough to tell the difference.
But keep it up, I don't mind clarifying my position, it makes for more posts from me.
Reread what you’ve blessed us with in this thread and decide if that gives you additional credibility.
You know about the tool scam, but many IBO's and prospects don't.
Didn’t you ask why the tool scam still exists? It’s because you’re so effective. The ‘Code Pink’ of the tools scam.
Funny you never bothered to identify what portions of those recommendations for India that you thought would be good for the US. Seeing as the ‘tool prices’ don’t change (your beef)…and you didn’t even notice that it had no effect on ‘tools’ not produced by Amway.
Very effective. And credible. It’s not ‘facts and logic’ that prevents people from discussing anything with you – it’s the exact opposite. You refuse to make sense, can’t form a simple argument with support other than saying ‘tools scam,’ refuse to read what you try to use as a reference – and then get mad when people call you on it.
Stick with whatever theory you want, it doesn't make it right.
Or perhaps you're so busy trying to be critical, you can't see the forest for the trees.
I reread it, and it's brilliant.
You expect something that has been around for decades to be turned off overnight?
I didn't need to mention which portions, it was a general statement, and I stated it as such. There's plenty of mention of tool costs in that letter. Read it again.
I'm not mad you can't understand simple logic, I find it amusing.
fStick with whatever theory you want, it doesn't make it right.
Theory: Tex isn't that bright.
I reread it, and it's brilliant.
So far, so good. Theory safe.
Now, the rest of that Texgarbage is a non-answer.
Simple logic - yes, and I've shown where you can't display that.
TexLogic - got me there...I can't understand that.
You shouldn't confuse Simple Logic with TexLogic. See my theory; it's still wonderfully supported, and I have you to thank!
yawn.
Just making sure any credibility you have remains in your own mind only.
You're doing a poor job of that.
I'm pleased by your opinion - it means I'm on target. You're not the one who needs to be convinced of what you are.
You shouldn't be pleased based on my opinion, you should be displeased based on your lack of facts. But you seem to be happiest when you are using the least amount of facts.
Although these are not the actual rules, they are already been implemented as if they are rules!
I know coz I'm building my business here in India!
An Amway India Official commented saying that they have had enuff of these headaches with tool abuses, and they forever don't want to defend themselves legally for the actions of these tool abusers!
As of now there's no real aversion abt these suggestions in the Indian IBOs.
Most are happy!
And these Success Seminars Amway had conduct have been a great hit with Diamonds from all the systems attending and inspiring us!
Amway India would soon release these talks at the Success seminars as BSMs.
What more could you ask for?
This is good news. Do you have any documentation of these events? What more could we ask for? Similar changes in the U.S.
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